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Quake really needs some generic .mdl open source models Goto page Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 Next

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scar3crow Inside3D Staff Joined: 18 Jan 2005 Posts: 837 Location: Las Vegas, NV

Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 12:40 am Post subject: |

Quote:
qme actually sucks for modeling... use a real model editing program, you will get better results.

Or not, I've tried 'real modeling programs' countless times, where I always bump against the ridiculous interfaces, and complete utter lack of tooltips in what should be professional programs. I even took 6 hours out of my Saturday once, and sat down with one of the 3d modelers at work. He guided me through the process of creating a VERY basic model, and applying a UVmap in modo and Maya, and I've gotta say, both programs are incredibly convoluted when it comes to such a simple process, and my friend even admitted as such, saying that it is a process of ramming your head against the program, until you memorize its long involved pathway.
Modo and Maya were a nightmare (I've also given Blender, Lightwave and Zbrush a try), even with the assistance of someone who gets paid to use them and is prolific with them, and they admitted that all of my troubles seemed to stem from program design.
I hope someday, someone designs a modelling program that is geared towards humans who exist in 3d space with the ability to move; but until that day arrives, the only program that has been in even the most remote ways humanly accessible and not fixed in a niche towards a particular mind type, will be qME.

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Baker Joined: 14 Mar 2006 Posts: 1538 |

Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 12:58 am Post subject: |

scar3crow wrote:
I hope someday, someone designs a modelling program that is geared towards humans who exist in 3d space with the ability to move; but until that day arrives, the only program that has been in even the most remote ways humanly accessible and not fixed in a niche towards a particular mind type, will be qME.

GMax and 3DMax are, quite frankly, easy as fuck to make models with, quite frankly.
All modelling software made by AutoDesk (the Auto-CAD people), and both of the above fall into that category are easy and intuitive to understand.
Maybe someone knows some QME secret I don't but in my experience QME is too vague and imprecise to make a model, but great for editing them.
/Debated on whether or not to use profanity, decided no substitute word could properly do the right emphasis.

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-z- Joined: 05 Mar 2008 Posts: 19 |

Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 4:33 am Post subject: |

Do md3's count? Nexuiz is a GPL darkplaces based game, I think it has some pretty good looking weapons. Even better... if a modder improves the future of an already existing weapon, it can make it into the core. Sounds pretty win win to me . _________________
Nexuiz Ninjaz - Practicing the ninja arts of Nexuiz | Happy 1 Year Ninjaz! - Mapping Contest to celebrate!

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Baker Joined: 14 Mar 2006 Posts: 1538 |

Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 5:23 am Post subject: |

-z- wrote:
Do md3's count? Nexuiz is a GPL darkplaces based game, I think it has some pretty good looking weapons. Even better... if a modder improves the future of an already existing weapon, it can make it into the core. Sounds pretty win win to me .

It counts about 80%.
I don't know if the frame animations are the same for the weapons (I'm not familiar with md3 enough to know the animation is done, but QuakeC would still control that with DarkPlaces right?) so I'm not sure if one could be dropped into a pk3 and substituted and it doesn't have any monsters per se, although some of the Nexuiz characters look like they could be bad guys. (Still I suspect this isn't compatible with the Quake progs.dat and most mods are mods of that).
It would be much preferable for a texture blending video to be a guy using some cool gun on a monster-looking Nexuiz character.

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ceriux Joined: 06 Sep 2008 Posts: 969 Location: Florida, USA |

Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 7:29 am Post subject: |

i still cant figure out any thing thats technically "profecinal" i use milkshape 3d, it has a very basic tool layout and it has alot of tutorials. iuse lith unwrap for uv mapping though. _________________ QuakeDB - Quake ModDB Group

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Wazat Joined: 15 Oct 2004 Posts: 732 Location: Middle 'o the desert, USA |

Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 5:00 pm Post subject: |

CocoT wrote:
Now, on that (and then I think I'll just stop rambling on these issues altogether), I have some reservation. My view of the mapping community is that there are still a majority of mappers (I hate to view it as a monolothic entity, I do know it's made up of different personalities, but I guess there are some "traits" that stick out a little more than others) who, in fact, are not particularly interested in QuakeC novelties, engine eye-candy or new models...

Or more correctly, their community at large is openly hostile to modders and engine programmers alike and they not-so-secretly wish we'd all die horrible, gruesome, tortured deaths over the course of many painful weeks.
But you know, it's nice to be nice about how we say it.
Honestly, there are some people on func_messageboard who are cool to the modders -- after all, pushplay made some maps for BattleMech and several of those folks come by here from time to time or visit our IRC channel and are on friendly terms with us. But you have to understand that they're the exception. Most of the community there hates mods, engines and modders for the most part, and they do not like to hear from us or hear about what we're doing.
At least, that's the impression I got from my interaction with them back when I cared to visit their forums. Maybe since then enough members have died of hemorrhoids or ulcers to swing the balance of power over to a more... moderate crowd.
(and yes, I'm being fairly facetious here, but part of me wants to say I'm not )
_________________
When my computer inevitably explodes and kills me, my cat inherits everything I own. He may be the only one capable of continuing my work.

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Wazat Joined: 15 Oct 2004 Posts: 732 Location: Middle 'o the desert, USA |

Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 5:06 pm Post subject: |

And BTW, I use Quark for my modeling and mapping needs. QME and the other tools never made a lick of sense to me, and I can barely get through making a map without Quark's very handy object list on the sidebar. But that's just crazy me. _________________
When my computer inevitably explodes and kills me, my cat inherits everything I own. He may be the only one capable of continuing my work.

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ceriux Joined: 06 Sep 2008 Posts: 969 Location: Florida, USA |

Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 6:32 pm Post subject: |

i use world craft for mapping anything that's usually in any of my maps i made from scratch _________________ QuakeDB - Quake ModDB Group

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goldenboy Joined: 05 Sep 2008 Posts: 310 Location: Kiel |

Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 1:59 pm Post subject: |

Quote:
Now, on that (and then I think I'll just stop rambling on these issues altogether), I have some reservation. My view of the mapping community is that there are still a majority of mappers (I hate to view it as a monolothic entity, I do know it's made up of different personalities, but I guess there are some "traits" that stick out a little more than others) who, in fact, are not particularly interested in QuakeC novelties, engine eye-candy or new models...

QuakeC novelties: RMQ is thoroughly gyrofied, and has stuff like custom keys, camera, "inventory" etc... Quoth contains a number of novelties, too... there are actually quite some maps that use Quoth.
Of course Kell, JPL, necros, ijed and me aren't "the mapping community". Most mappers knock up their own progs, instead of coming to i3d. I can say that it was a blessing for our little project that DrShadowborg joined the team, without a competent coder we would be making another "custom progs by mappers".
Engine eye candy: The short version is I like eyecandy, as much as the next guy, but I don't like becoming dependant on an engine. I suspect most mappers think the same, or else there would be Darkplaces specific maps by now. (Yes, I know DP is more than eyecandy, it's just the obvious example). They are content that their maps CAN benefit from DP's eyecandy, optionally. DP also doesn't have the best image in the mapping community.
New models: We're using Orion's debugged models; and there are a couple smaller models for misc stuff added. I don't think anyone wants to remodel the monsters or something, though, or we would be sitting at this in 2016 still. o_O
I guess we should patiently wait for Ruohis to finish his models. They're all md3 though, so there is the issue of engine compatibility again (non-issue if you map/mod for Darkplaces).
Find Ruohis' remodelling project on the quakeworld.nu forums. I think the weapons are already there, so... you could use those for DP videos.
Ruohis' weapons/items etc
http://www.quakeworld.nu/forum/viewtopic.php?id=312
Ruohis' monsters project:
http://www.quakeworld.nu/forum/viewtopic.php?id=2960

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goldenboy Joined: 05 Sep 2008 Posts: 310 Location: Kiel |

Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 2:05 pm Post subject: |

And what is it that's wrong about the HUD? Is it the HUD graphics, or the whole look and layout? Graphics aren't the problem, there are faithful high-quality replacements that look like the original, but better. Layout/usage? How would a better HUD look?

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goldenboy Joined: 05 Sep 2008 Posts: 310 Location: Kiel |

Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 2:15 pm Post subject: |

And, finally, Remake will be open source so you can take the maps, code, and add md3 models and DP features and CSQC menus later and release your own version for Darkplaces, and then you will have your next-gen Quake mod. And everybody will be happy.
Except the guys with slower computers, and deathmatch players, and faithful fanboys, and OpenBSD users, etc. pp.
It won't have 24 bit textures either. :-/

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CocoT Joined: 14 Dec 2004 Posts: 599 Location: Belly-Gum |

Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 2:22 pm Post subject: |

Thanks for the links, Goldenboy, that's awesome stuff! (I should visit http://www.quakeworld.nu more often! ) _________________ http://www.planetcocot.net/

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goldenboy Joined: 05 Sep 2008 Posts: 310 Location: Kiel |

Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 2:24 pm Post subject: |

Everybody should. I check their Graphics section regularly :-E MoonDrunk's high quality faithful HUD: http://www.quakeworld.nu/forum/viewtopic.php?id=2126 Orion's Debugged models: http://www.primevil.fr/index.php?path=quakeworld/models/
OK, none of this stuff is GPL, but I'm not clear about why you need GPL models for a video.

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Baker Joined: 14 Mar 2006 Posts: 1538 |

Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 3:01 pm Post subject: |

I did a bad job titling the thread and probably confused at least 2 people in the thread. I didn't mean "Quake" as "Quake" but as the engine itself in the context of total conversions or near total conversions (Conquest, TransloQuake, mods using Quake 3 bsp and texture blending or heavy physics alterations) forced to use ogres, rocket launchers and the Quake HUD because there aren't effort-free nice high tech modernish substitutions available to showcase these things better.
Last edited by Baker on Sun Oct 26, 2008 3:03 pm; edited 1 time in total

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MeTcHsteekle Joined: 15 May 2008 Posts: 397 Location: its a secret |

Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 3:02 pm Post subject: |

http://www.kolumbus.fi/ruohis/models.htm [the bottom of the page] _________________ bah

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