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Dr. Shadowborg Inside3D Staff Joined: 16 Oct 2004 Posts: 726 |

Posted: Mon May 31, 2010 8:56 pm Post subject: |

mrgreezy3 wrote:
i am currently converting my avi vid of hellsmash beta 3 psp to a smaller format since my internet kinda sucks it may take a while to get this vid on youtube, no later then today i will post a link up with some footage from hellsmash beta 3 on psp but no download link will be available until We decide whats the verdict with that engine modification. Dont wanna release it until we have it really situated

Cool.

mrgreezy3 wrote:
Downsider: Can you code the engine so the folder it looks to load is named HellSmash. this is how i have my psp set up so all that would have to be done is a simple switch of the eboot. I dont even have a Id1 folder on my psp i dont know for sure if i have the pop.lmp but i know i have no Original q1 maps on there.(is it possible to get this to load without that pop.lmp similiar to kurok?)
About User map option: this would make things so much easy when it comes to loading a map. you can still have certains maps in engine. and you can pick any map from ur memorystick in the maps folder....SWEET!!!

You must have some id1 stuff in there (or some kurok equivalent), because hellsmash would complain otherwise. (I think a few original id1 sounds are used, plus there should be a monster or two that isn't included in hellsmash distro. (this is due partially to legality issues, and also to some monsters not having enhanced variations or ability to be stoned...)
I've thought about standaloning Hellsmash, and while attractive from the standpoint of "woohoo, free quake!", it is also quite impossible at my current skill level. (because to do it right would mean remodelling everything (ground up weapon models, designing equivalent monsters, modelling, animating them, 100% original textures, etc.), something I currently lack the skills to do all by myself, and too massive a task to expect anybody to want to help with.)

Downsider wrote:
I'm not doing too much for you guys because I have exams and my own projects and whatnot, obviously, but I will give you: 1) HUD 2) Menu 3) More modern particles 4) That map selection thingie you were talking about

That's more than enough for what we need.
* Adds Downsider to credits list, pokes mrgreezy3 to do the same for HS PSP credits
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Dr. Shadowborg Inside3D Staff Joined: 16 Oct 2004 Posts: 726 |

Posted: Mon May 31, 2010 9:11 pm Post subject: |

mrgreezy3 wrote:
Dr Shadowborg : i was Wondering if you Dont mind Pulling Down the Links in this topic to fix hellsmash to work for the psp(the sprite fixes and progs.dat for psp) because once i upload this video and people see it they are gonna google your mod and find this topic and try to download the files before we even have it ready for the psp community. I have spent 2 days trying to get your mod to work before i found out what was wrong. its ok if you dont wanna take the links down concerning the psp i understand.

Done. Also added a note in the first post of this thread that a PSP version is forthcoming so they won't get mad.
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leileilol Joined: 15 Oct 2004 Posts: 1321 |

Posted: Mon May 31, 2010 9:43 pm Post subject: |

Downsider wrote:
I'm not doing too much for you guys because I have exams and my own projects and whatnot, obviously, but I will give you: 1) HUD 2) Menu 3) More modern particles 4) That map selection thingie you were talking about

Bonus points for backporting all this to Dqu..err Winquake.
QSR was made on Pentiums for Pentiums (the 200mhz kind). Shoving in too many modern things would defeat that and actually kill the oldschool-esque atmosphere it has.
And yeah that model... i really should finish that. What was my TODO again? Death animations and some slash animations?
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mrgreezy3 Joined: 26 May 2010 Posts: 25 |

Posted: Mon May 31, 2010 10:35 pm Post subject: |

leileilol wrote:

Downsider wrote:
I'm not doing too much for you guys because I have exams and my own projects and whatnot, obviously, but I will give you: 1) HUD 2) Menu 3) More modern particles 4) That map selection thingie you were talking about

Bonus points for backporting all this to Dqu..err Winquake.
QSR was made on Pentiums for Pentiums (the 200mhz kind). Shoving in too many modern things would defeat that and actually kill the oldschool-esque atmosphere it has.
And yeah that model... i really should finish that. What was my TODO again? Death animations and some slash animations?

the psp is 333mhz while running quake
psp-1000(phat) 32 mb ram 333mhz
psp-2000/3000(slim) 64 mb ram 333mhz
pspgo : unknown but is stronger the slim i know for a fact and can now run some homebrew
i think the psp can handle what we are throwing at it have you ever seen solitude on a modified quake engine it runs great....

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leileilol Joined: 15 Oct 2004 Posts: 1321 |

Posted: Mon May 31, 2010 10:37 pm Post subject: |

mrgreezy3 wrote:
the psp is 333mhz while running quake psp-1000(phat) 32 mb ram 333mhz psp-2000/3000(slim) 64 mb ram 333mhz

The PSP isn't a Pentium, and that 333MHz is quite slower than a P200 actually when it comes to Quake. Quake makes a lot more math and logic calculations than most of the PSP library so the requirements are a lot heavier.
If one wanted good PSP performance, all the models would have to be redone a lot lower poly with small textures (128x128) and the maps would need to be much simpler with as few surface leafs as possible (stretching textures helps). To make a "PSP port version" really count would mean redoing all media with awareness of strict limitations.
meh what effort am I really expecting anyway? probably some modified version bootstrapped to some full or shareware Quake redistributed as a standalone game full of copyright infractions within psphomebrewland... then dr.s being hounded by kids wanting a solid snake or master chief or zombies or naruto or digimon or something. The suggestion of using the GPL map sources is illogical enough for the copyleft license conflicts alone, this is a hobbyist mod for a copyrighted game not some full freeware game project
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Downsider Joined: 16 Sep 2008 Posts: 477 |

Posted: Mon May 31, 2010 11:30 pm Post subject: |

leileilol wrote:
meh what effort am I really expecting anyway? probably some modified version bootstrapped to some full or shareware Quake redistributed as a standalone game full of copyright infractions within psphomebrewland... then dr.s being hounded by kids wanting a solid snake or master chief or zombies or naruto or digimon or something. The suggestion of using the GPL map sources is illogical enough for the copyleft license conflicts alone, this is a hobbyist mod for a copyrighted game not some full freeware game project

Good job, sir. You've officially made me laugh my ass off.

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Dr. Shadowborg Inside3D Staff Joined: 16 Oct 2004 Posts: 726 |

Posted: Mon May 31, 2010 11:34 pm Post subject: |

leileilol wrote:
QSR was made on Pentiums for Pentiums (the 200mhz kind). Shoving in too many modern things would defeat that and actually kill the oldschool-esque atmosphere it has.

True this.

leileilol wrote:
And yeah that model... i really should finish that. What was my TODO again? Death animations and some slash animations?

Investigation of the model I have indicates:
1. Model Skin "armoring" on the backside appears incomplete.
2. Pain animations
3. Death animations
4. Slash Animations
5. Dynamite doesn't match to the hand on the throw animation

leileilol wrote:
The PSP isn't a Pentium, and that 333MHz is quite slower than a P200 actually when it comes to Quake. Quake makes a lot more math and logic calculations than most of the PSP library so the requirements are a lot heavier. If one wanted good PSP performance, all the models would have to be redone a lot lower poly with small textures (128x128) and the maps would need to be much simpler with as few surface leafs as possible (stretching textures helps). To make a "PSP port version" really count would mean redoing all media with awareness of strict limitations.

This is indeed true. Still, it'll be funny to see Hellsmash running on a PSP, and equally interesting to see if it gains any popularity regardless of this.

leileilol wrote:
meh what effort am I really expecting anyway? probably some modified version bootstrapped to some full or shareware Quake redistributed as a standalone game full of copyright infractions within psphomebrewland... then dr.s being hounded by kids wanting a solid snake or master chief or zombies or naruto or digimon or something.

*shrugs*
My answer to kids wanting solid snake, etc. is a flat out NO starting out. I did LOL at this though.

leileilol wrote:
The suggestion of using the GPL map sources is illogical enough for the copyleft license conflicts alone

GPL map sources: I'd actually prefer this not be done personally, Hellsmash is at it's best when it's got it's own maps to work with.
That said, I was under the impression that this was for a deathmatch map pack, and no hellsmash specific changes beyond what the mod does simply by running it is going to be implimented. This should probably okay, (especially if the map pack itself is divested away from Hellsmash proper) and is preferable to going around ignoring readme.txt legal agreements about not redistributing in any way other than the original archive.

leileilol wrote:
this is a hobbyist mod for a copyrighted game not some full freeware game project

Indeed.
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mrgreezy3 Joined: 26 May 2010 Posts: 25 |

Posted: Mon May 31, 2010 11:59 pm Post subject: |

im not trying to break no laws here ok i just love the mod and to be honest the maps i have download from quake sites run pretty well i can fight 4 or 5 bots with no lag(depending on map size) As far as the resizing of textures on models i have done it to a few of the models(256x256) and they look the same i have a trick to keep the quality of the skins i can take care of "dumming" everything down for psp compatibility. I have Completed the sounds already i just have to redo the models again.
*models with high poly can cause a problem but so far everything is well.*
i dont want no one to get into trouble i was just thinking why not every quake player get to experience this wonderful mod... as far as kids idk about that i am grown so quake is a classic to me, i have 1,2,and 3 . quake 4 wasnt really quake to me so i stopped at 3. so really im not breaking any laws.
Im gonna wait on posting the vid unless Dr. Shadowborg wants to see his mod Handheld.... its up to you
last but not least : i am working on a gfx.wad for the psp version mainly to blend in with the title and colors
dr do you have any maps u use for hellsmash because if not we dont have to put maps in the mod that is what the user map options in the engine would be for so breaking laws in this aspect is obsolete

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Dr. Shadowborg Inside3D Staff Joined: 16 Oct 2004 Posts: 726 |

Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 12:31 am Post subject: |

mrgreezy3 wrote:
im not trying to break no laws here ok i just love the mod and to be honest the maps i have download from quake sites run pretty well i can fight 4 or 5 bots with no lag(depending on map size) i dont want no one to get into trouble i was just thinking why not every quake player get to experience this wonderful mod... as far as kids idk about that i am grown so quake is a classic to me, i have 1,2,and 3 . quake 4 wasnt really quake to me so i stopped at 3. so really im not breaking any laws.
Im gonna wait on posting the vid unless Dr. Shadowborg wants to see his mod Handheld.... its up to you
last but not least : i am working on a gfx.wad for the psp version mainly to blend in with the title and colors
dr do you have any maps u use for hellsmash because if not we dont have to put maps in the mod that is what the user map options in the engine would be for so breaking laws in this aspect is obsolete

I think leileilol's main complaint was the idea of attempting to standalone this.
Posting the vid: I can wait for this until you and Downsider get the engine mods and gfx.wad out of the way.
Aside from the maps that came with the PC Hellsmash release, I don't have any particular map that I play this on regularly in SP, for DM I play on everything from id1 dm1-6 (these are in pak0.pak and pak1.pak and should NOT be distributed), and some of the maps from the Dredd Map Pack.
Maybe if the user map select engine mod is implimented a small "favorite" map compilation could be released separately from this?
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Baker Joined: 14 Mar 2006 Posts: 1538 |

Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 12:57 am Post subject: |

leileilol wrote:
The suggestion of using the GPL map sources is illogical enough for the copyleft license conflicts alone, this is a hobbyist mod for a copyrighted game not some full freeware game project

I was addressing this:

Quote:
Yeah, but you still have to check the readme permissions. Some of them say that you can only distribute them as the original archive. And then there are the "Authors MAY NOT use these maps as a base for additional work" clauses...

I won't even pretend that most people, especially your rank and file PSP homebrew community member, know how to use the license correctly.
I was providing information.
Case in point, the RQuake mod was packaged with about 70 custom single player releases and the Undergate mod was packaged with 104 single player maps.
I *read* 100% of the readme files to check against the author's wishes. One map I really wanted in the Undergate was by Tyrann with a "Don't redistribute this map outside the file clause" in the readme ... so I contacted Tyrann to get his permission.
Providing information that some people aren't going to understand or will misuse isn't a good reason to not provide the information. The thread I linked also has some public domain map sources and "do anything you like, just don't use it commercially and please credit me" type map sources.
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mrgreezy3 Joined: 26 May 2010 Posts: 25 |

Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 3:37 pm Post subject: |

i have decided not to release any maps with ur mod due to legal reasons(i dont want ur project to stop) i am gonna ask mdave if it is ok to use his models to replace the original quake models.. so we dont have to worry about legel issues....
Downsider: Whats the verdict with the wonderful engine mod??? can we exppect it to be availible soon. I am Currently reducing the weapon skins for the psp imma try 128x128 and see what it looks like will update you guys later

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Downsider Joined: 16 Sep 2008 Posts: 477 |

Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 7:27 pm Post subject: |

If someone can get me icons for each weapon for weapon selection I can finish it by the end of the week, provided school doesn't get in the way.

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mrgreezy3 Joined: 26 May 2010 Posts: 25 |

Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 9:44 pm Post subject: |

Downsider wrote:
If someone can get me icons for each weapon for weapon selection I can finish it by the end of the week, provided school doesn't get in the way.

Dr.shadowborg PLease pm Downsider The Pics you Gave me of ur Weapons, to be Honest i have erased everything from my pc except for the psp Build....

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leileilol Joined: 15 Oct 2004 Posts: 1321 |

Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 11:01 pm Post subject: |

mrgreezy3 wrote:
i have decided not to release any maps with ur mod due to legal reasons(i dont want ur project to stop) i am gonna ask mdave if it is ok to use his models to replace the original quake models.. so we dont have to worry about legel issues....

Or you could just abandon the unneccessary idea of treating it as a standalone game for the kids that don't own Quake. Leave it as a mod.
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mrgreezy3 Joined: 26 May 2010 Posts: 25 |

Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 11:35 pm Post subject: |

leileilol wrote:

mrgreezy3 wrote:
i have decided not to release any maps with ur mod due to legal reasons(i dont want ur project to stop) i am gonna ask mdave if it is ok to use his models to replace the original quake models.. so we dont have to worry about legel issues....

Or you could just abandon the unneccessary idea of treating it as a standalone game for the kids that don't own Quake. Leave it as a mod.

honestly i wasnt thinking of this as a standalone. i just wanted it to be availible on my psp i own quake 1-3 so to me it is a mod it woud be cool to have psp owner play against pc owners (i have done this too) via internet
(i will just keep the models in that are originally in the mod)
the thing is on a psp you cannot do like darkplaces and load up seperate mods... so really on the psp it would only be hellsmash that is the only way it can be played.
i dont want you guys to think im trying to turn this into something else i dont wanna cause any problems. when i did release a link to the psp version i was going to definitly indicate that this is a quake modification, i have multiple quake mods on my psp but honestly hell smash really cught my attention so i thought "why not have this portable" i dont wanna cause any harm my friend

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