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Posted by [Kona] [118.92.141.23] on 2008/08/19 14:30:31

Alright, so I re-installed Worldcraft and loaded it up for the first time in 6-7 years. Looks pretty basic, I'll get the hang of it pretty quick again.
Problem is I have no textures. And if I remember correctly, i've never made a single map using ID textures. So, are there any awesome new textures out there for Quake that people want to see used in a Q1 map? I'm thinking anything that isn't base. I want to do something metal or gothic like Autumn Haunting, only bigger and more epic. Oh and what compile tools do we use these days? I installed Worldcraft 3.3 with the Q1 adapter. Is that hip now?
Oh ps. I redesigned my website, now hosted at http://www.electricescape.com/ethe...
Telefragged/Atomic Gamer are cocksucking sons of bastards that deleted my site long ago because 'apparently' I had porn on there. They won't reinstate it.

Is Anything "hip" Now?
#1 posted by Lardarse [62.31.165.111] on 2008/08/19 14:41:39
Most people here tend to use WC of some flavour. Personally, I prefer GTKRadiant, but that's only because I'm used to it now.
Metal and gothic makes me think of knave.wad, althoguh that's almost been done to death by Kell. You are likely to get directed to the Quaddicted wad archive at some point in this thread to get them all. But I can't be arsed to find the link...
Tadaa
#2 posted by Text_Fish [82.32.29.116] on 2008/08/19 14:53:50
http://www.quaddicted.com/wads/
Lucky guess --^
Loving the new website Kona, nice and bloody.
I'd Love To See
#3 posted by [83.30.45.187] on 2008/08/19 15:14:11
your take on the Knave texes :)
Oooh!!!
#4 posted by RickyT23 [86.139.123.36] on 2008/08/19 15:23:53
More Kona maps!!!!
Yes Please. Love the website. WC3.3+Quakeadapter (its on Quakeone.com) is the best thing to use IMO - it has better texturing and texture lock than 1.6 and a 3D accelerated view. The only flaw is that you can't increase the texture brightness :(
This is exciting!
Also
#5 posted by bambuz [193.167.6.174] on 2008/08/19 15:43:50
Not very new and not entirely non-id textures but there's Speedy's CR8 and Speedbaze:
http://speedy.planetquake.gamespy....
Hmm
#6 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/08/19 16:13:20
This required a thread?
Nonentity
#7 posted by Lardarse [62.31.165.111] on 2008/08/19 16:57:32
I think any legendary mapper (or near legendary... I'm not sure what the difference is around here) returning to mapping would be threadworthy. Would you really complain if it was someone like ELEK?
Hmm
#8 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/08/19 18:09:53
Yes. Yes I would. Same goes for any old mapper returning (with the possible exception of headshot deciding to make a new map). And in specific reference to ELEK; knowing him he'd have expected me (or someone else) to kick off if he'd done this...
In fact, it's actually less excusable when it's someone who's been around a while, they should know the standard etiquette for func, including the purpose of the GA thread.
Oh, and the bullshit about 'any legendary mapper' can fuck right off. While I respect Kona's work (along with the work of many, many designers over the years) that does not mean he deserves any special treatment.
I'm not sure what the difference is around here - The difference is that if a random newbie has to obey the rules, so does the most seasoned veteran. It's not one rule for us another rule for the many, it's called equality. Try it rather than acting like a blind fan boi hero worshipping your personal jeebus.
You Just Jealous
#9 posted by RickyT23 [81.157.18.43] on 2008/08/19 18:11:54
Hmm
#10 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/08/19 18:20:23
Oh, and couple of other points just occurred to me;
You seem to be labouring under the impression that anything that is an 'interesting piece of information' deserves it's own thread.
Unfortunately this is not the case, the discussion threads are for... well... discussions. Topics where various viewpoints can be expressed, discussed and debated till either a conclusion or nonsense is reached. Films, gameplay theories, largescale memes, those kinds of things.
Now obviously this thread is far from that, it's a basic question/answer (in fact, a question/answer that is less than 150 posts previous in GA), something that is far more suited for mapping help or general abuse, which I'm sure Kona will accept and take into account in the future.
However, you seem to be arguing that the return of formerly retired mappers is somehow a discussion topic. This makes no sense to me, there is little to discuss (other than ego-feeding, etc) in this, making it unsuitable to a discussion thread, but maybe a news thread would be suitable. It is after all a piece of information to be disseminated amongst the users (a la other news posts).
Thing is, I doubt that even you would argue that a piece of news that contains no new releases (maps/textures/code/wha'ever), no links to a potentially beneficial resource and frankly little of major import deserves to be in the news listings on the front page...
Which brings me back to my point (which you seem to disagree with, although I've yet to see an argument supporting why this is);
This belongs in mapping help or general abuse.
#11 posted by JohnXmas [217.162.89.119] on 2008/08/19 18:24:08
WTF nonentity?
Ethereal Hell is back!
This is worth a new thread, imho.
(Great design, btw...)
Errr...
#12 posted by JohnXmas [217.162.89.119] on 2008/08/19 18:28:29
no links to a potentially beneficial resource
nonentitiy,
Ever visited Ethereal Hell before?
Hm
#13 posted by Lunaran [24.158.1.74] on 2008/08/19 18:30:01
maybe a news thread would be suitable.
oh really?
Hmm
#14 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/08/19 18:38:49
Ever visited Ethereal Hell before?
Well since you mention it... Yes, since back when it was that evile flash abortion Shambler hated so much. And taken from the current front page;
Welcome to Ethereal Hell, the homepage for level designer Shaun [Kona] Ross. This website is an archive of my legacy on Quake, Quake2, Quake3 and Half-Life.
Archives of an author's own maps that are already hosted on other sites aren't really 'potentially benefical resources' now are they?
And while I can see how you'd think;
Oh ps. I redesigned my website, now hosted at
was the focal point of the thread, especially given that the title is "EH gets new host"... Oh, wait, no, it's "Kona Needs Quake Textures". You see why I might be slightly confused.
Oh, and as a final note, the potentially beneficial blah line was talking about things being valid for news submissions. Not discussion threads. This is a discussion thread.
Feel free to actually understand my point before you respond to it again. Or then again, not, the counter arguments are so much easier this way. It's your call.
Hmm
#15 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/08/19 18:40:28
oh really?
ya rly.
Now stop quoting me out of context ;p
Bananas.
#16 posted by Text_Fish [82.32.29.116] on 2008/08/19 18:49:05
Holy Crap
#17 posted by Tronyn [24.78.41.15] on 2008/08/19 18:51:45
are you having a bad day?
anyway I thought I'd contribute something to the thread while it's actually a thread (if it isn't, I can't help that).
[Kona], I'd recommend not using pure Kell (kdmtex, apocrypha, knave) textures, as, awesome as that theme is, I actually think by now it has been overdone. However there are tons of good textures in there. Maybe try combining it with something else (Sock Egyptian which comes with WC, or Heretic 2). I recommend Heretic2.wad, it's underused and it's interesting.
There are some good modified metal textures, but they're mostly in DM maps (and House of Spikes).
Yeah I remember original Unforgiven - lol, good thing you released your maps! My main map for unforgiven has 650+ monsters and tons of little bugs. I'll get to fixing/finishing it after Arcanum.
For compile tools, and engines, make sure to get aguirRe's Quake stuff. THE most helpful set of mapping tools EVER. Compilers/engines give you stats on everything - what limits you're breaking, exactly what problems the map has where - incredibly useful. Without these tools, epic sized maps would probably be impossible.
Hmm
#18 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/08/19 18:57:16
Not really, I just posted 4 (imo fairly accurate) words and got the flame icon in response. I generally take that as a cue to start shooting...
Nonentity,
#19 posted by JohnXmas [217.162.89.119] on 2008/08/19 19:10:02
Archives of an author's own maps
Ever clicked on 'Reviews' 'Ratings' or 'Level Of The Month' links on EH?
If not, you should go there.
Reading is good to calm down when throwing such a tantrum.
Btw, enough 'discussion thread' for me right now! ;)
I Hate You Nonentity
#20 posted by RickyT23 [90.217.64.245] on 2008/08/19 19:12:21
You have ruined my day with your trivial preciousness.
This should have been posted as a discussion thread. There is a lot to discuss here. Kona is back and he is asking US for help, as well as re-introducing his website.
Well, whatever. He wants to have a discussion about it. Not about you defending your argument that he should have posted this in GA. Why dont you get a job as an old tired history teacher (female) or something. Go and buy yourself a really thick pair of glasses an sneer at bored little children. I would love to play you at chess. :)
Kona - I would use the tools provided with the Quakeadapter. Unless you want coloured lights in which case I would find the latest version of Tyrlite. Also AguirRe's modified GLQuake is really useful for bug finding.
More at http://user.tninet.se/~xir870k/
(AguirRe's site)
Also
#21 posted by RickyT23 [90.217.64.245] on 2008/08/19 19:14:38
I think WC3.3 is hip, but may dont and prefer Radiant or something. Not sure. Also that BSP editor is meant to be pretty good nowadays. Or the recent version of QuArK. And someone said OGIER. Dont know what that is.
Hmm
#22 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/08/19 19:18:36
Stop. Quoting. Me. Out. Of. Context.
And Ricky, the reason people get disciplined in school is that children tend to not understand rules. The same applies here, with the exception that I assume the majority are old enough to be aiming for something slightly above childish disregard for etiquette...
And yeh, this still shouldn't have been a thread, as proven by the fact that it's pretty much the quaddicted archive link, the aguirre tools link and a discussion about what should be a thread...
Hmm
#23 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/08/19 19:19:21
OGier, lit, the one who is more OG (Original Gansta)
Lol
#24 posted by Tronyn [24.78.41.15] on 2008/08/19 19:55:08
well I've enjoyed this thread.
Title Should Be Changed:
#25 posted by ijed [216.241.20.2] on 2008/08/19 20:13:49
nonentity vs. Rickyt23 thread
For what it's worth there have been some really pathetically shit discussion threads, can't say I'm bothered by this one.
And it did make for some interesting comments.
Oh, Yeah
#26 posted by ijed [216.241.20.2] on 2008/08/19 20:15:10
Welcome back [Kona], look forward to your new maps.
Site redesign looks pretty nice.
#27 posted by metlslime [64.175.155.252] on 2008/08/19 21:59:10
Nice site design, though it's just weird to have images for heading text just so you can use some font you like. But then again, many sites do it.
Are you going to start reviewing again?
#28 posted by [Kona] [118.92.141.23] on 2008/08/20 02:17:52
Gosh this thread took off. Thanks for the recommendations. That Quaddicted wads page is awesome, I'll download all those.
Those Speedy textures look good too. Some awesome industrial levels could come from those.
Cheers for the website compliments :)
Metlslime: i'd love to still do reviews if there was 48 hours in a day :P Sometimes I wish I didn't have to bloody eat & sleep, it's such a waste of time.
Nonentity: I don't know who you are, or what you've made for the community, but this thread is about discussing the latest textures or textures that haven't been used much and players want to see. Sure it'll benefit me, but it can benefit many others aswell (which is what I intended). If I named it "Textures Discussion" would you be complaining still? I don't see any other texture discussion threads, and I'm sure one is more beneficial to Quake level development than 'drunk thread' which has over 300 posts. Anyway, it's just a thread. Who really cares?
Now admit it nonentity, I'm your personal jeebus too. Hail to me :P
*popcorn*
#29 posted by RickyT23 [90.217.64.245] on 2008/08/20 02:29:06
Hang On A Minute...
#30 posted by RickyT23 [90.199.193.146] on 2008/08/20 03:08:53
Nonentity
#7 posted by Lardarse [62.31.165.111] on 2008/08/19 16:57:32
I think any legendary mapper (or near legendary... I'm not sure what the difference is around here) returning to mapping would be threadworthy. Would you really complain if it was someone like ELEK?
Hmm
#8 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/08/19 18:09:53
Yes. Yes I would. Same goes for any old mapper returning (with the possible exception of headshot deciding to make a new map).
Er.... OK you loose. Who's headshot anyway?
If he turns out to be a dead mapper then I appologise
Hmm
#31 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/08/20 04:05:16
Who's headshot anyway?
Which Maps Did He Make?
#32 posted by RickyT23 [90.199.193.146] on 2008/08/20 04:16:43
forgive the rookie
my point I think you understand is clear:
If not one mapper then why another? All of a sudden you've sent yourself from talking about the the ethics of posting on forums to which mapper is the most legendary?
Hmm
#33 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/08/20 04:20:22
He made some stuff. Did some website malarky too. Liked stuff shaped like A.
Headshot
#34 posted by Lunaran [97.87.13.222] on 2008/08/20 05:32:12
co-created 'dapak' for quakeworld, a collection of multiplayer maps of a quality sufficient to help birth the quake community and deserving of the 'legendary' term this thread's flinging around.
he also created the qboard, the first discussion board for quake mappers to hang out together and actually talk about the craft. the term 'general abuse', the style of thread organization, and part of the look of func_msgboard are all based on the original community page.
he closed every thread on qboard one day after he felt the discussion there had become so frivolous and off-topic there wasn't any reason to keep it open.
Please
#35 posted by inertia [24.164.67.55] on 2008/08/20 07:37:50
so celebrated as to having taken on the nature of a legend; "the legendary exploits of the arctic trailblazers"
shut up everyone.
Cool!
#36 posted by RickyT23 [81.157.18.43] on 2008/08/20 10:15:14
So what happened to Headshot?
He Also Made Some Damn Good Q2dm Levels
#37 posted by nitin [124.168.0.138] on 2008/08/20 11:59:36
and then disappeared, much like ztn (yes I realise he made q3 stuff too but still).
The Only Thing I Want To Know
#38 posted by Drew [203.189.134.3] on 2008/08/20 12:07:33
is if this means Kona will do a speedmap. I'm sure it would be good practice/excercise!
<º)))<
#39 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/08/21 05:25:08
<º)))<
#40 posted by Vigil [91.152.66.83] on 2008/08/21 07:40:00
he closed every thread on qboard one day after he felt the discussion there had become so frivolous and off-topic there wasn't any reason to keep it open.
Some could argue that things haven't really changed since.
[Kona], welcome back, and return to #terrafusion, please.
#41 posted by [Kona] [118.92.142.201] on 2008/08/21 10:24:19
Thanks mate. Yeah might load up to old mirc sometime and check out #tf.
Holy Shitballs
#42 posted by Mr Fribbles [59.167.141.66] on 2008/08/22 16:31:51
Er.... OK you loose. Who's headshot anyway?
I BANISH THEE for one trivial but particularly annoying fail followed by one of epic proportions!
Lol
#43 posted by Tronyn [24.78.41.15] on 2008/08/22 16:37:59
well if Headshot did that (I hardly remember Qboard), it's a good thing Metlslime is much more tolerant :)
This Thread Is Fun!
#44 posted by Mr Fribbles [59.167.141.66] on 2008/08/22 16:39:32
he also created the qboard, the first discussion board for quake mappers to hang out together and actually talk about the craft.
Definitely the first one that actually mattered... but not the first ;)
Headshot was also a great gentleman and he was a great inspiration to me (one of the main reasons I started mapping was his levels showed me that user maps could be not only as good as, but better than, the levels that shipped with the game).
I believe he didn't have any interest in a game industry job though, and created his own advertising company... SleepwalkR can probably tell you more. He still drops in from time to time, though very rarely.
What
#45 posted by Bal [82.234.123.21] on 2008/08/22 16:40:17
The only entity more powerful than Headshot is Frib and Peej put together, or Shambler and Pauk arguing on IRC.
Kona
#46 posted by Mr Fribbles [59.167.141.66] on 2008/08/22 16:51:51
Hi! :D
You need to use Aguire's tools - though you may want a copy of Q1Rad lying around in case you want to experiment with that too.
To use anything else is bordering on foolish, because there's so much added functionality and coolness provided by those tools that you'd be silly to ignore them.
As for editors, I'd recommend GtkRadiant 1.2 or 1.4, though it's a right royal pain to set up if you don't have good instructions. If you've used Worldcraft in the past then I guess the most sensible thing to do is get the most recent version of WC/Hammer than you can persuade to edit Q1 maps and go with that.
Oh Yeah, And
#47 posted by Mr Fribbles [59.167.141.66] on 2008/08/22 16:56:05
What's with all the pissing and moaning? Someone created a discussion thread to promote... discussion? Unless I missed something, this is good, right?
If I can create completely fucking stupid threads and nobody even bats an eyelid, I don't see what's wrong with this thread.
I particularly don't like it when newcomers get slapped down for creating minor threads (not that that applies here), especially when as has been acknowledged many times, that's how most other forums work. And let's face it, it's not like they're interrupting the intense flurry of in-depth discussion by bumping off the "Frib is an asshat" thread.
Headshot...
#48 posted by Shambler [77.97.138.124] on 2008/08/22 17:01:29
Headshot was also a great gentleman and he was a great inspiration to me
But not a great inspiration for you being a great gentleman?? ;)
Hmm
#49 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/08/22 17:06:21
Ofc not. Frib's a true lady.
Shambler
#50 posted by Mr Fribbles [59.167.141.66] on 2008/08/22 17:10:22
Clearly not!
Also Nonentity
#51 posted by Tronyn [24.78.41.15] on 2008/08/22 17:12:45
although I do think the discussion in this thread has been unfair to you (even if I was quite amused by it), why would you be so surprised that a guy who started mapping for Quake 2-3 years ago wouldn't know who headshot is? Lunaran's response was much more helpful; how are people new to the community ever going to find out anything if it's just like OMG YOU DONT KNOW?!
anyway, not condemning you, I'm sure this thread has been enough of a nuisance to you
PS: untried texture combinations that would be cool:
Egyptian (of any type) + Kell
Daikatana E3 + Kell (fmb_bdg was doing this a little)
IKwhite + Heretic 2
Fribbles
#52 posted by RickyT23 [81.157.18.43] on 2008/08/22 17:14:59
Er.... I give up
How am I supposed to know stuff like that?
Who is allowed to start a thread because they have returned to mapping more - Kona or Headshot?
Well I have never heard of Headshot, but Kona I have. Go figure. Im not a l00tist n33b, or whatever it is you might say....
Re: Also Nonentity
#53 posted by Zwiffle [66.170.5.18] on 2008/08/22 20:38:04
I've actually tried Kell with a bunch of things, including egypt textures as well as idbase. The egypt project was going pretty well too I must say, I should look into finishing it/finding it on my HDD somewhere.
Zwiffle
#54 posted by Tronyn [24.78.41.15] on 2008/08/22 22:18:17
sounds like an orgy
if I ever started a new from scratch map, I was going to do a whole new map depicting a decrepit Middle Eastern city with ancient Egyptian tombs/ruins throughout - vaguely similar to the style of the "Arabian Nights," but much larger and more detailed, using Rogue/Hexen2/Sock Egypt textures, but with a huge amount of Kell textures, using Quoth2 - and call it "Nyarlathotep"
but I will never have time.
idbase+kell sounds bizarrely cool
What Is "kell?"
#55 posted by metlslime [64.175.155.252] on 2008/08/23 00:41:05
kell made like 10 texture sets, which one are you talking about?
Thanks Fribbles :)
#56 posted by [Kona] [118.92.142.201] on 2008/08/23 01:06:43
jebus so kell's done quoth1+2, contract revoked, and like 10 textures sets! i'd say he is quake's saviour of the 2000's.
By "Kell" I Mean
#57 posted by Tronyn [24.78.41.15] on 2008/08/23 01:11:37
knave.wad, kdmtex.wad, apocryphal.wad
basically the classic stone/metal/bookcases look
[KONA]!
#58 posted by biff_debris. [66.191.244.17] on 2008/08/23 03:16:08
Whao, long time buddy.
And I Counter With A
#59 posted by Mr Fribbles [59.167.141.66] on 2008/08/23 04:17:42
BIFF!
Ricky
#60 posted by Mr Fribbles [59.167.141.66] on 2008/08/23 04:22:07
How am I supposed to know stuff like that?
Because we helpfully tell you these things, after the requisite expression of disbelief.
Who is allowed to start a thread because they have returned to mapping more - Kona or Headshot?
Anyone can start a thread.
But
#61 posted by ijed [190.20.66.209] on 2008/08/23 04:37:42
The ritual stoning always take place, or only for posts as stupid as this one?
Conglomerate
#62 posted by RickyT23 [90.211.135.154] on 2008/08/23 05:05:21
with me
band finished
Not Directed At Anyone In Particular, But Here's My Happy Opinion
#63 posted by Tronyn [24.78.41.15] on 2008/08/23 05:12:59
X is leet enough to start a thread, Y is not - is retarded
I respect headshot as much as anyone, but as soon as it becomes subjective you lose your ability to condemn the guy for starting a thread
anyway, fuck the idea of the community being elitist at all. No one gets ANY KIND of status, or respect, or self esteem boost, that is unwarranted based on their current reasonability and activity in the community. You build up pyramids and stacks of self-reinforcing respect and worship and try to pass this shit along, you are nothing more than a self-contained group of self-esteem masturbators, no better than any man who knows how to masturbate. I will continually praise the maps of people who I think are great but I never give their name a royal goddamn deference.
you have an opinion you have to explain it to justify it. Otherwise, you've got no more say than some dumbass who showed up yesterday and thinks e1m1 is the best Q1 map ever made.
Also:
#64 posted by RickyT23 [90.211.135.154] on 2008/08/23 05:16:01
why would you be so surprised that a guy who started mapping for Quake 2-3 years ago wouldn't know who headshot is?
Tronyn
I'm sorry for quoting you but Deja-Vu came out 1 year Ago. And it took me six weeks to make. I have been mapping for one year. 27th Septmeber. Thats when it came out.
Hah
#65 posted by Tronyn [24.78.41.15] on 2008/08/23 06:30:12
well after so much time in Q1 I really have no idea what happened when; I don't mind, in fact what you are saying helps my argument; the fact is, if people like you did not show up every year or so and start contributing (if it has been only a year since you showed up! crazy to think!) then there would be no community.
#66 posted by [Kona] [118.92.142.201] on 2008/08/23 10:59:45
well, i thought e1m1 was pretty cool :P
So I Told Him Who Headshot Is
#67 posted by Lunaran [97.87.13.222] on 2008/08/23 16:40:45
and now he knows, wtf is the big deal here
No one gets ANY KIND of status, or respect, or self esteem boost, that is unwarranted based on their current reasonability and activity in the community.
This is funny because I'm not sure you're aware that you're still kind of describing elitism.
Encourage Elitism
#68 posted by RickyT23 [90.199.193.104] on 2008/08/24 05:08:05
without being a cock
(this isnt aimed at anyone, but its interesting, do you think it's possible?)
How About No?
#69 posted by Mr Fribbles [59.167.141.66] on 2008/08/24 05:23:11
For as long as this crap has been going, there's always been some spanktard whining about elitism because of some perceived injustice or whatever.
The simple fact is that we always have been and always will be accepting of and helpful to new mappers. Good maps get the recognition they deserve. What else do you want? (We even put up with Ricky... ;)
A lot of people here have some pretty high standards, but both crusty old-timers and newcomers alike are held to the same high standards. Generally this is a good thing and results in higher quality maps being released. Occasionally someone decides to get hyper-sensitive and takes personal offense to criticism, but hey, welcome to the internet kids... grow a thick skin or fuck off.
Its True Man
#70 posted by RickyT23 [90.199.193.104] on 2008/08/24 05:27:20
i've had a lot of support from the community, you can just look at it as a list of what could be good and what sucks, i.e. what to do and what not to do
also just learning how to make a map work, learning the importance of engine limits etc, vis blocking, ra ra ra
:)
#71 posted by Tornyn [24.78.41.15] on 2008/08/24 15:51:47
alright sorry, you are right that in the last few years the community has generally been welcoming/supportive. I apologize.
Oh Dont Get Me Wrong
#72 posted by RickyT23 [90.199.193.104] on 2008/08/24 20:37:04
there been plenty of offensive stuff said to me and others, but you can either take offense to it or just take the point and move on.
Generally
#73 posted by Tronyn [24.78.41.15] on 2008/08/24 20:50:45
the issue, that I'm guilty as much as (or more than) anyone else, is shit when it's uncalled for. In the many Quaddicted interviews so far released (thanks Spirit, great idea!) most people seem to think that this forum is far more honest than usual (I haven't seen many other design forums, but if they are just circle-jerks then the design output will suck) - which I totally agree with. The only problem is being an asshole when it's not called for which I admit I'm guilty of at times (I'll leave it at that). Anyway, I'm glad to see new mappers because they extend the community's life and they tend to try things that aren't sanctified (sometimes bad, sometimes good).
On Topic And Off
#74 posted by necros [99.227.108.217] on 2008/08/24 22:50:05
topic: has anyone done a q1sp/dm map with the deadmeat textures? they're up on the quaddicted wad archive, and they look nice and have a complete array of stuff (as well as looking great in the quake palette).
that could be a nice one maybe.
off topic: i think art forums get it more than most. you should see some of the 3d cg forums... sometimes you'll get a guy who's posting something that's complete crap and who clearly needs to spend a lot more time learning wtf he's doing and you get comments like "this is a great start, keep it up". i think comments like that are more damaging than helpful. in the cases i'm talking about, continuing on with a bad model is the worst possible choice. you'll run into all sorts of problems with bad topology and poorly planned edge loops/edge flow. starting over (as harsh as it sounds) is the best choice. you take what you learnt from your failed experiment and start anew with more knowledge. sometimes saying "that's fine for your first work, but you'll need to start over with more attention to xxxxx" is the wiser choice.
On Criticism
#75 posted by Lunaran [97.87.13.222] on 2008/08/25 02:45:31
When I very first started getting into any kind of computer graphics at all, I was pretty young, and pretty terrible. The friends I happened to fall in with online at the time were ... not encouraging, but almost patronizing, which I was of course too immature and young to pick up on. So I kept up with it, and eventually developed the ability to be self-critical and to strive for improvement on my own.
I think sometimes there's an effort in the art community to treat people the opposite of what they need, which I think is kind of necessary, because too much criticism early on can make an artist or designer overly defensive and encourage him to become set in his undeveloped ways too early. When someone is new and making lots of mistakes, tell them they should keep going, and when someone is a veteran guru, never say anything nice about their work ever again. It's not what their work needs, but it's what they need. It's not always simply about the output, it's about the confidence and growth of the person behind it. I think I like it that way, because too often people shit on those who can least withstand it, and fellate the egos of those who need a shot of humility more than anything else.
Ricky, you are a terrific mapper and you should never stop shining.
There's Something To That, Lun.
#76 posted by necros [99.227.108.217] on 2008/08/25 02:50:11
unless you thought i meant 'shit all over the guy if he sucks'. i *did* mean constructive criticism after all. :)
it's just that, all too often, i see someone post some work that is quite bad and no one will drop any criticism at all. and then the next post is more of the same, and the next, etc etc.
Thanks Lun :.
#77 posted by RickyT23 [90.199.193.104] on 2008/08/25 04:43:45
No, You're Right
#78 posted by Lunaran [97.87.13.222] on 2008/08/25 05:30:12
one extreme is as bad as the other.
and you're welcome.
Necros
#79 posted by Spirit [213.39.146.225] on 2008/08/25 09:31:12
The only one I know: http://dsp.quaddicted.com/dspdm6/
There Is A Dm Map Geodm1
#80 posted by spy [92.47.237.119] on 2008/08/25 19:16:07
i'm just curious from where the texture set (and who is the author of the texes?)
Hang On
#81 posted by ijed [216.241.20.2] on 2008/08/25 20:58:48
I don't know if Ricky Qualifies as needing encouragement - his last few maps have been great.
#82 posted by gibbie [145.116.239.162] on 2008/08/25 21:05:12
spy: geo made them himself just for that map, if i remember correctly
So Don't You Mean
#83 posted by Lunaran [24.158.1.74] on 2008/08/26 01:35:01
"his last few maps could have been better"?
:)
I Guess You Could Say
#84 posted by SleepwalkR [85.179.16.31] on 2008/08/27 10:23:27
"his last few maps left less to be desired than their predecessors"
I'm Back Bitches!!!
#85 posted by ELEK [67.129.250.254] on 2008/08/28 02:21:37
Now somebody kick off for my eliteness! W00T!!
"And in specific reference to ELEK; knowing him he'd have expected me (or someone else) to kick off if he'd done this..."
err...wtf does that mean anyhow?
Am I an egotistical twat? Nope, I just like Chives and beer...
Lun, when are we going to meet up at The Old Fashioned again? Oh, and Manveer is not invited, he always tries to touch my privates!
...
#86 posted by Elek [67.129.250.254] on 2008/08/28 02:22:04
Not really...I don't do so much mapping anymore...
Elek, The Choice Is Yours Anyway...
#87 posted by JohnXmas [217.162.89.210] on 2008/08/28 02:33:52
I don't do so much mapping anymore
...but I'm craving for any new map from you!
I can't say how many times I went there up the ledges of Neh Tides and how I continuously dive in that precipice (one of my all time Q1 fave map)...
Many thanks for these great pieces of Quake dream!
Qxepo
#88 posted by ijed [190.20.65.59] on 2008/08/28 03:48:14
Is bringing alot of stuff out of the woodwork, not least a fair few great (unretired?) mappers.
Elek
#89 posted by Lunaran [24.158.1.74] on 2008/08/28 04:15:54
Anytime, dude. And I like your preconditions.
Isn't
#90 posted by ijed [190.20.65.59] on 2008/08/28 04:17:43
Bees one of the prerequisites to l33tness as well?
Fuck You ELEK
#91 posted by Scampie [24.158.1.74] on 2008/09/05 06:35:34
not inviting me.
Heh
#92 posted by Asriel [130.216.59.69] on 2008/11/24 08:55:17
I learnt what the word 'elitist' was from this forum. Good times.
Get Out Of Here Noob
#93 posted by starbuck [129.215.58.128] on 2008/11/26 18:08:28
#94 posted by Trinca [194.65.24.228] on 2008/11/26 18:10:17
hey guys, i will start soon a new mediaval map!!!
advices on a .wad please!?!?!?
Trinca
#95 posted by JPL [82.234.167.238] on 2008/11/26 20:55:44
Hexen2, Daikatana ep3, knave, medieval... and some from Id ;)
#96 posted by Trinca [89.180.139.58] on 2008/11/26 22:05:31
CDA2 Trinca version? :)
Forget It
#97 posted by JPL [82.234.167.238] on 2008/11/26 22:39:56
It will be my next map... a CDA sequel :D
Rober !!!
#98 posted by Trinca [89.180.139.58] on 2008/11/26 22:56:30
thks god JPL i´m sick of base maps like Spirit :)
Metal Maps
#99 posted by ijed [190.20.74.139] on 2008/11/27 03:26:51
FTW
Also...
#100 posted by JPL [213.30.139.243] on 2008/11/27 08:42:06
.. I think base map are quite boring and let less possibilities in creation and fantasy.. but this is my personnal taste....
Well, I launched yesterday evening my latest project first beta test run... I hope to get news from the participants soon :D
More Mix-theme Maps!
#101 posted by negke [88.70.55.88] on 2008/11/27 09:16:40
#102 posted by metlslime [67.180.230.20] on 2008/11/27 09:53:09
I don't think base maps are boring. Being a more realistic setting, they have a lot of potential for functional details, recognizable locations, and hooks for storyline (as do medieval maps.) The downside is, they are generally very literal, whereas metal or elder world maps tend to be more abstract and visceral.
Of course, medieval and base maps CAN be surreal and abstract, especially the low-poly old-school ones, but even those have somewhat more ties to logic and less ties to emotion, than metal and elder world maps.
Base Vs Medieval
#103 posted by JPL [213.30.139.243] on 2008/11/27 10:08:24
The feeling is quite different from mapper to mapper. I mean that personally, I prefer medieval maps...
I think the different potential comes from the Quake bestiary: as example the standard Quake bestiary is more accurate for medieval map than base map... a reverse example is Quoth2.
Now regarding the architecture potential, it is equivalent for sure, and it depends clearly of mapper inspiration...
Well, afterall, it is just a personal feeling ;)
#104 posted by necros [99.227.108.217] on 2008/11/27 10:58:29
i think i'd like to interject here and say that i don't think base maps have to conform to that 'it has to look like something real (to a certain extent)' idea.
ne_doom wasn't really realistic at all, it had floating stuff, gigantic nonsensical machinery, poky bits for no reason other than to be poky...
i think the hardest thing about doing a base map is getting outside of the whole 'base' sphere.
just my 0.02. feel free to tear it up. :)
#105 posted by Willem [75.177.185.17] on 2008/11/27 11:34:31
I really enjoy the base theme as I think it creates very clearly defined spaces. The textures lend themselves to clean lines which I like a lot.
Medieval/metal/elder are definitely more abstract and you can get away with the "this whole level is some sort of abstract space" vibe much more easily. I also think these maps tend to look nicer if done properly.
Not Sayin' Nuffin'
#106 posted by RickyT23 [81.132.88.108] on 2008/11/27 11:45:31
#107 posted by Trinca [194.65.24.228] on 2008/11/27 12:04:35
i made 2 big base maps now i need some rest in mediavel :)
Necros
#108 posted by JPL [213.30.139.243] on 2008/11/27 13:13:28
just my 0.02. feel free to tear it up. :)
I will not :P : as I said, it is really a personal point of view, and also a personal inspiration feeling... If base maps provide better inspiration than medieval maps (or the reverse), it is up to the mapper to do whatever he wants...
At the end, the most important is the fun you have either creating the map, or playing the map... or both ;)
#109 posted by Trinca [194.65.24.228] on 2008/11/27 14:27:05
true, now go start another one :p since the one u´ve got start beta :) i go map to becouse i already got some idears for next map!
Old Qdoom
#110 posted by MadFox [84.26.168.11] on 2008/11/28 22:29:42
By conversing "The Hangar" for Quake I had a hard carrot with the extremely enhanced visuality of the map.
Of course, it are the Doom textures, but the experience of seeing the old monsters in a new look makes the gameplay rather sciensefiction.
Also stuffing it up with the skulls harrisment of ten, and the health bowl of 50 make it play on a different skill.
I would give something to understand the Mechtec setup.
Bowl And Skull
#111 posted by MadFox [84.26.168.11] on 2008/11/28 23:01:28
How does this fit as substitute for the Doom models?
http://members.home.nl/gimli/bowl....
#112 posted by Trinca [89.181.102.98] on 2008/11/29 01:06:12
roulfff weardooooooooooooooooooo
#113 posted by Trinca [89.181.102.98] on 2008/11/29 01:06:55
leave old Doom and Quake as it should be :)
#114 posted by [Kona] [118.92.178.180] on 2008/11/29 03:12:00
base pisses me off. i'd rather see base in q2. q1 is for metal, gothic, medieval imo. no other game does it as well. but plenty of games offer far better 'base' than q1.
Lol!OK Screnies Imminent!
#115 posted by RickyT23 [82.20.37.149] on 2008/11/29 03:17:18
But remeber its supposed to be an episode.
Are you impatient, or do you want an episode?
Big piece of me wants to help with Remake-Quake, but another large piece wants to make an episode.
Gimme a week and the first map (which as you all know is always a base map) will be in alpha. And you know how I do it - 1 map at a time. Grrrr.......
I dont know what to do.
Kona
#116 posted by nitin [124.168.110.226] on 2008/11/29 03:51:11
play ricky's last map and tell me that it's not as good a base map as in any other game.
Madfox
#117 posted by RickyT23 [82.20.37.149] on 2008/11/29 04:31:22
I love it!
A bit more detail wouldn't kill, but it looks very authentic. the "quake large shells" look out-of-p-lace there though. Gimme good old doom-looking shells please! ;P
Uhm
#118 posted by MadFox [84.26.168.11] on 2008/11/29 04:53:57
I must apoligize to trinca, i will never do Quake any harm again with my truncinized maps.
it took more place in converting doom models and all in a Quake map, so why not the health bowl and skull.
As I mapped the skull.bsp again, I forgot it rests on another hull.
Now it looks sunk.
Can't find the map again though, aargh.
http://members.home.nl/gimli/skull...
Eh?
#119 posted by RickyT23 [82.20.37.149] on 2008/11/29 05:00:44
Dude - dont kill the skull!!!
In Quoth there is a worldspawn spawnflag to use models of the items - health, ammo etc - then they take shadows!!!
So:
Make a model of the skull.
Or else you can have it fullbright!
O
#120 posted by MadFox [84.26.168.11] on 2008/11/29 08:10:05
I wondered how to get a bsp model in it.
I didn't shoot the sherrif!
http://members.home.nl/gimli/doom3...
[Kona]
#121 posted by HeadThump [4.136.90.105] on 2008/11/29 08:36:45
By base are we talking about just the texture set which I agree is the least interesting of the Quake sets or do you mean game style? If the later, Gun Cotton rates as one of the best, and I can't see any reason to hate it.
Base
#122 posted by ijed [190.20.124.114] on 2008/11/30 03:03:22
Depends if you mean idbase or not. Base theme tends to get dismissed because everyone thinks - 'ah flat old level design clothed in idbase'.
Even idbase can be used in new ways still - there's been a few idbase maps over the past year that have really shone and done something new.
Weather base or medievel, metal or elder is best is entirely subjective.
Monsters are a problem, but name me a good unmodified progs base map that uses only grunts and enforcers. Could be I'm forgetting something obvious there.
Madfox, I think they need to be rounder - a few extra verts or maybe even convert the original sprites, though I guess you've tried that.
Ricky, the black goat wants YOU!
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipe...
Ijed
#123 posted by RickyT23 [82.20.37.149] on 2008/11/30 03:23:22
I love your maps. No bones about it. You and me both will stick up for IdBase for reasons you and I know. You dont spend months working on something just for it to be dismissed because of the texture set.
Now I am - say 80% through with my current MAP, but that means 16% through a POTENTIAL EPISODE.
I really dont know what to do, because I have recieved an email from the project-website-thingy for every thing that you and Gb have suggested, and frankly it sounds really cool. Awesome infact (although I do think that painskins would work if done properly)(although I would have blood-splat zombie gibs sliding down walls if it was left up to me too, so... ).
What I mean is "do I release my map when finished or do I take it to a small episode level of say - 3 levels - a base, a midevil and then a metal? (I wouldnt try an Elder map because I am so unfamiliar with the format....)"?
I mean do you want another project on the go, seperate from Remake Quake, or do you want all guns aimed at Remake Quake?
:P
#124 posted by Willem [75.177.185.17] on 2008/11/30 11:39:32
idbase is hella fun. I love the clean lines and the consistent look to it. I'll always be a fan. I'm going to make my next map medieval just so I can force myself into a different style.
Well
#125 posted by ijed [190.20.85.145] on 2008/11/30 14:55:48
It's up to you what you make. All the code we're working on means the maps are getting neglected so it'd be good to have some help on that side.
I've got complete playthrough alphas for six maps of epsiode 3, but I need to overhaul alot of it. And e3m7 is pretty fun to work on, experimenting with the new enemies.
Most boring secret level? Trying to change that.
Blood splats - we could well be doing that engine-side.
I'm thinking of attacking the Elder maps next . . . mixing dungeon otherworldness and organic elements.
Making an episode on your own is fun, even if it has a bad affect on your social life, but to be honest making an episode in a team has a similar effect.
#126 posted by [Kona] [118.93.63.185] on 2008/12/08 08:46:12
HeadThump: thanks mate. I totally forgot I actually made a base q1sp, haha.
Anyways I guess I mean both the style and the texture set - but idbase in particular has been done to death. Certainly there are some awesome q1sp base maps, even in idbase. I just prefer all the other Quake styles, because I feel Q1 is more suited for horror than a high-tech base. Ricky... make an episode :D
Hmm
#127 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/12/08 11:53:00
High tech base? Sure, better in Q1. But what about grimy, industrial/rusted base styles? Given the Q1 base monster set they seem to fit equally well within the scope of Quake as any other world castle...
Hmm
#128 posted by nonentity [87.194.146.225] on 2008/12/08 11:53:25
Better in Q2 even. But y'all could infer that I'm sure
Brown
#129 posted by preacher_ [82.182.48.187] on 2009/05/02 17:27:25
brown is good, you can't go wrong with brown :)
Making Life Richer
#130 posted by kuppa [203.82.79.101] on 2009/10/20 05:10:50
superrrrrrrrr
Kuppa Kutty
#131 posted by kuppa [203.82.79.101] on 2009/10/20 05:12:08
super figureee
Kona
#132 posted by Stubgaard [85.81.121.4] on 2009/10/21 11:27:08
A bit off topic, but we've recently added another of your old maps to the Speed Demos Archive. The map in question is alk08, the other being alk07 which we added to the archives some time back in 2000.
http://speeddemosarchive.com/quake
(there's some demos on alk08 in the newest update)
http://speeddemosarchive.com/quake...
http://speeddemosarchive.com/quake...
Other than that I just want to welcome you back, you've made some really great looking maps over the years. Sadly most of them I haven't been added to SDA because of "new textures/monsters/etc." issues.
Stubgaard
#133 posted by [Kona] [118.93.39.213] on 2009/10/23 08:16:31
Thanks dude I'll check them out :D
Kuppa
#134 posted by kut [203.82.92.149] on 2009/10/26 09:12:25
watlah u talking kona so stupid!
Kut
#135 posted by kuppa [203.82.92.149] on 2009/10/26 09:14:32
hey everybody shut up n stop 2 commend,no job isnthttp://www.celephais.net/board...
I Swear
#136 posted by Spirit [213.39.187.161] on 2009/10/26 10:24:23
I did NOT create a func comment generator
...
#137 posted by meTch [72.10.122.69] on 2009/10/27 13:16:42
i don't get it
Blooper
#138 posted by MadFox [84.26.187.83] on 2010/11/09 07:18:56
I was trying to make a new water texture. Something that could look like a waterfall. There is a +fall animation that works like 8 bmp-files. They are attached like +0_name.
Having the new Quake Retextured set I was wondering how a 512x512 tga of 16M colours can be used with only the name #water.tga?
I can split up the file in other bmp or tga's, so I'm not getting the idea behind it.
Sure the retextured files look good, and I'm not sur a good animating texture can be made for it. But I would like to give it a try.

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